Comments on: I'm Funding Indiana "In God We Trust" License Plates http://www.chrishardie.com/blog/2007/04/im-funding-indiana-in-god-we-trust-license-plates.html Personal Blog for James Christopher Hardie Wed, 07 Jan 2009 17:04:17 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.1 By: Chris http://www.chrishardie.com/blog/2007/04/im-funding-indiana-in-god-we-trust-license-plates.html#comment-86411 Chris Tue, 18 Nov 2008 15:55:14 +0000 http://www.chrishardie.com/weblog/archives/2007/04/im-funding-indiana-in-god-we-trust-license-plates.html#comment-86411 A further update today from Ken Falk of the ACLU of Indiana: <blockquote> The Court of Appeals entered its decision yesterday which, unfortunately, found that allowing the "In God We Trust" license plate to be free was not unconstitutional, even though there are administrative fees charged for other specialty plates, like the environmental license plate. No final decision has been made as to whether to ask the Indiana Supreme Court to review this case. I am sorry we were not successful and I thank you for your help. Ken </blockquote> <a href="http://www.courier-journal.com/article/20081118/NEWS02/811180441/" rel="nofollow">More on the court's ruling</a>. A further update today from Ken Falk of the ACLU of Indiana:

The Court of Appeals entered its decision yesterday which, unfortunately, found that allowing the "In God We Trust" license plate to be free was not unconstitutional, even though there are administrative fees charged for other specialty plates, like the environmental license plate. No final decision has been made as to whether to ask the Indiana Supreme Court to review this case.

I am sorry we were not successful and I thank you for your help.

Ken

More on the court's ruling.

]]> By: Melaney http://www.chrishardie.com/blog/2007/04/im-funding-indiana-in-god-we-trust-license-plates.html#comment-85787 Melaney Sun, 22 Jun 2008 05:43:35 +0000 http://www.chrishardie.com/weblog/archives/2007/04/im-funding-indiana-in-god-we-trust-license-plates.html#comment-85787 In response to William Bennett's April 12, 2008 posting: About these "idiots, jerks, and good-for-nothing-low-lifes" you refer to...who made these people anyway? I'm sure you didn't mean to bite the hand that made you. "Forgive them, father, for they know now what they do..." In response to William Bennett's April 12, 2008 posting:
About these "idiots, jerks, and good-for-nothing-low-lifes" you refer to...who made these people anyway? I'm sure you didn't mean to bite the hand that made you. "Forgive them, father, for they know now what they do..."

]]> By: Chris http://www.chrishardie.com/blog/2007/04/im-funding-indiana-in-god-we-trust-license-plates.html#comment-85136 Chris Fri, 18 Apr 2008 13:10:06 +0000 http://www.chrishardie.com/weblog/archives/2007/04/im-funding-indiana-in-god-we-trust-license-plates.html#comment-85136 A further status update from the ACLU on 4/18/2008: <blockquote>I received today the trial court's decision in the case that you assisted me with concerning the In God We Trust license plate. Unfortunately, the court ruled against us and found that it is not unconstitutional to provide the license plate for free. I have included the decision for you. We are probably going to be appealing. Hopefully, we can get a different result in the Court of Appeals. Thank you for your help in the case. Ken Falk Kenneth J. Falk Legal Director ACLU of Indiana 1031 E. Washington St. Indianapolis, IN 46202 317/635-4059 ext. 229 fax: 317/635-4105 </blockquote> A further status update from the ACLU on 4/18/2008:

I received today the trial court's decision in the case that you assisted me with concerning the In God We Trust license plate. Unfortunately, the court ruled against us and found that it is not unconstitutional to provide the license plate for free. I have included the decision for you. We are probably going to be appealing. Hopefully, we can get a different result in the Court of Appeals.

Thank you for your help in the case.

Ken Falk

Kenneth J. Falk
Legal Director
ACLU of Indiana
1031 E. Washington St.
Indianapolis, IN 46202
317/635-4059 ext. 229
fax: 317/635-4105

]]> By: Chris http://www.chrishardie.com/blog/2007/04/im-funding-indiana-in-god-we-trust-license-plates.html#comment-85105 Chris Sun, 13 Apr 2008 03:25:11 +0000 http://www.chrishardie.com/weblog/archives/2007/04/im-funding-indiana-in-god-we-trust-license-plates.html#comment-85105 Bob: I'm assuming that since Rep. Burton attends Greenwood Christian Church, he would have introduced the bill requiring taxpayers to fund a statement that at least doesn't OPPOSE a Christian God, and probably one that SUPPORTS trusting in a Christian God. But it doesn't really matter to me; the point is that the notion of trusting in God (any God) belongs in the realm of religion, spirituality and the choices of individuals, not as a government-funded public display of faith. I don't see what immigration legislation has to do with this issue; you're welcome to expand your remarks if you think there's a real connection. The "get a life" statement seems to be a popular way to attempt to argue a counter-point to these posts. For what it's worth, I take it to mean that in the absence of actual substantive thoughts on the matter, you are left only with name-calling as a desperate parting shot. The irony, of course, is that most of the Gods known to humanity would likely dictate a little more respect and love in interpersonal communications than we've seen from those who would argue the importance of plastering "In God We Trust" everywhere. Hmmm. Bob: I'm assuming that since Rep. Burton attends Greenwood Christian Church, he would have introduced the bill requiring taxpayers to fund a statement that at least doesn't OPPOSE a Christian God, and probably one that SUPPORTS trusting in a Christian God. But it doesn't really matter to me; the point is that the notion of trusting in God (any God) belongs in the realm of religion, spirituality and the choices of individuals, not as a government-funded public display of faith.

I don't see what immigration legislation has to do with this issue; you're welcome to expand your remarks if you think there's a real connection.

The "get a life" statement seems to be a popular way to attempt to argue a counter-point to these posts. For what it's worth, I take it to mean that in the absence of actual substantive thoughts on the matter, you are left only with name-calling as a desperate parting shot.

The irony, of course, is that most of the Gods known to humanity would likely dictate a little more respect and love in interpersonal communications than we've seen from those who would argue the importance of plastering "In God We Trust" everywhere. Hmmm.

]]> By: Bob http://www.chrishardie.com/blog/2007/04/im-funding-indiana-in-god-we-trust-license-plates.html#comment-85104 Bob Sun, 13 Apr 2008 03:05:59 +0000 http://www.chrishardie.com/weblog/archives/2007/04/im-funding-indiana-in-god-we-trust-license-plates.html#comment-85104 And which God are you ASSUMING they're referring to? Could it be the one of YOUR choice? Would you rather fund illegal aliens getting free education of the taxpayers? Get a LIFE!!!! And which God are you ASSUMING they're referring to? Could it be the one of YOUR choice? Would you rather fund illegal aliens getting free education of the taxpayers? Get a LIFE!!!!

]]> By: Chris http://www.chrishardie.com/blog/2007/04/im-funding-indiana-in-god-we-trust-license-plates.html#comment-85101 Chris Sat, 12 Apr 2008 19:50:33 +0000 http://www.chrishardie.com/weblog/archives/2007/04/im-funding-indiana-in-god-we-trust-license-plates.html#comment-85101 William, a few notes: -You just told a bunch of people who you don't know that they are "idiots," "jerks," and that they need to "get a life." Did that make you feel good? Is that how you approach every conversation where you don't agree with others? How does that help contribute to a reasonable discussion about an issue that's clearly important to you? Your apparent lack of respect for others is astonishing. -I'm sorry, but the logic of "there are other kinds of taxpayer-funded programs that are problematic, so this one isn't worth addressing" doesn't really work for me. If you'd like to argue that this is a low-priority concern in your opinion, that's fine. But that doesn't make it automatically worth ignoring altogether. -I don't believe we pay the Federal Reserve any extra to print currency with "In God We Trust" on it (which, you're right, is an issue worth discussing) than we would pay if the currency didn't have the slogan. In this case, taxpayers were compelled to pay for license plates with that slogan on it IN ADDITION to the existing plate printing expenses. I don't think anyone here has advocated addressing one issue to the exclusion of addressing the other. -You seem to think that by not establishing a *specific* religion, and by endorsing religion more generically in a reference to a generic God, we don't have to be concerned about state-endorsed religion. I would submit that even a generically-made God reference is still a strong religious statement and again, not one that I want funded in a compulsory way. -I'm not sure that your opinion of the utility of the ACLU is relevant to this issue, but thank you for sharing. Chris William, a few notes:

-You just told a bunch of people who you don't know that they are "idiots," "jerks," and that they need to "get a life." Did that make you feel good? Is that how you approach every conversation where you don't agree with others? How does that help contribute to a reasonable discussion about an issue that's clearly important to you? Your apparent lack of respect for others is astonishing.

-I'm sorry, but the logic of "there are other kinds of taxpayer-funded programs that are problematic, so this one isn't worth addressing" doesn't really work for me. If you'd like to argue that this is a low-priority concern in your opinion, that's fine. But that doesn't make it automatically worth ignoring altogether.

-I don't believe we pay the Federal Reserve any extra to print currency with "In God We Trust" on it (which, you're right, is an issue worth discussing) than we would pay if the currency didn't have the slogan. In this case, taxpayers were compelled to pay for license plates with that slogan on it IN ADDITION to the existing plate printing expenses. I don't think anyone here has advocated addressing one issue to the exclusion of addressing the other.

-You seem to think that by not establishing a *specific* religion, and by endorsing religion more generically in a reference to a generic God, we don't have to be concerned about state-endorsed religion. I would submit that even a generically-made God reference is still a strong religious statement and again, not one that I want funded in a compulsory way.

-I'm not sure that your opinion of the utility of the ACLU is relevant to this issue, but thank you for sharing.

Chris

]]> By: William Bennett http://www.chrishardie.com/blog/2007/04/im-funding-indiana-in-god-we-trust-license-plates.html#comment-85100 William Bennett Sat, 12 Apr 2008 19:28:08 +0000 http://www.chrishardie.com/weblog/archives/2007/04/im-funding-indiana-in-god-we-trust-license-plates.html#comment-85100 Soooo, I guess all of you idiots who want to ditch the "In God We Trust" license plates are ready to ditch all of your money as well!!! Since the same motto is printed and stamped on ALL of our currency and coin. You jerks need to get a life. If you don't like, or don't agree with the license plate, then don't get one. The minimal extra charge to make them can't possibly approach the monumental sums Indiana taxpayers dole out to good-for-nothing low-lifes who live off of the public trough all their lives. I don't ever recall the phrase "In God We Trust" harming anyone. BTW, there is NO SUCH THING as separation of church and state. The U.S. Constitution prohibits the government from establishing a state religion. The state of Indiana establishes no specific religion by putting "In God We Trust" on a license plate. Then there's the ACLU; what a useless organization. Have they ever done anything worthwhile? The answer is, "never have and never will." Soooo, I guess all of you idiots who want to ditch the "In God We Trust" license plates are ready to ditch all of your money as well!!! Since the same motto is printed and stamped on ALL of our currency and coin. You jerks need to get a life. If you don't like, or don't agree with the license plate, then don't get one. The minimal extra charge to make them can't possibly approach the monumental sums Indiana taxpayers dole out to good-for-nothing low-lifes who live off of the public trough all their lives. I don't ever recall the phrase "In God We Trust" harming anyone. BTW, there is NO SUCH THING as separation of church and state. The U.S. Constitution prohibits the government from establishing a state religion. The state of Indiana establishes no specific religion by putting "In God We Trust" on a license plate. Then there's the ACLU; what a useless organization. Have they ever done anything worthwhile? The answer is, "never have and never will."

]]> By: Chris http://www.chrishardie.com/blog/2007/04/im-funding-indiana-in-god-we-trust-license-plates.html#comment-82124 Chris Mon, 10 Mar 2008 01:42:14 +0000 http://www.chrishardie.com/weblog/archives/2007/04/im-funding-indiana-in-god-we-trust-license-plates.html#comment-82124 A follow-up status report from the ACLU on 2/25/2008: <blockquote>Hi. We finally had our summary judgment hearing this morning in the In God We Trust license plate case that you helped with. This was the hearing before the trial judge where each side argued why it should win. The hearing was uneventful and the Judge took the matter under advisement. We will be submitting our proposed findings within the week. I am unsure when there will be a decision. I will let you know as soon as I hear anything. I am sorry this is taking so long and thanks for your help. Ken Kenneth J. Falk Legal Director ACLU of Indiana 1031 E. Washington St. Indianapolis, IN 46202 317/635-4059 ext. 229 fax: 317/635-4105</blockquote> A follow-up status report from the ACLU on 2/25/2008:

Hi. We finally had our summary judgment hearing this morning in the In God We Trust license plate case that you helped with. This was the hearing before the trial judge where each side argued why it should win. The hearing was uneventful and the Judge took the matter under advisement. We will be submitting our proposed findings within the week. I am unsure when there will be a decision. I will let you know as soon as I hear anything.

I am sorry this is taking so long and thanks for your help.

Ken

Kenneth J. Falk
Legal Director
ACLU of Indiana
1031 E. Washington St.
Indianapolis, IN 46202
317/635-4059 ext. 229
fax: 317/635-4105

]]> By: Melaney http://www.chrishardie.com/blog/2007/04/im-funding-indiana-in-god-we-trust-license-plates.html#comment-24170 Melaney Tue, 15 May 2007 17:27:41 +0000 http://www.chrishardie.com/weblog/archives/2007/04/im-funding-indiana-in-god-we-trust-license-plates.html#comment-24170 God is incredibly awesome! But I'll be damned if I am hoodwinked into getting this plate under these circumstances. I proudly chose the generic one, exercising my freedom to choose. How many people got the plate to save the money and could care less about what it says? (but, hey, it makes the state look good, right?) About as effective as some religions scaring small children into saying certain prayers so they don't "go to hell and be with the devil." "Yep, saved another one!" And the child has no clue what just happened, nor any reason or awareness to live the life of what that prayer promised. Always will be a rebel... God is incredibly awesome! But I'll be damned if I am hoodwinked into getting this plate under these circumstances. I proudly chose the generic one, exercising my freedom to choose. How many people got the plate to save the money and could care less about what it says? (but, hey, it makes the state look good, right?) About as effective as some religions scaring small children into saying certain prayers so they don't "go to hell and be with the devil." "Yep, saved another one!" And the child has no clue what just happened, nor any reason or awareness to live the life of what that prayer promised. Always will be a rebel...

]]> By: Adam Bee http://www.chrishardie.com/blog/2007/04/im-funding-indiana-in-god-we-trust-license-plates.html#comment-22385 Adam Bee Wed, 02 May 2007 05:40:51 +0000 http://www.chrishardie.com/weblog/archives/2007/04/im-funding-indiana-in-god-we-trust-license-plates.html#comment-22385 <i>"Please get a life and let us conservatives live ours."</i> That's just the point. Hoosiers who don't necessarily subscribe to that statement are paying for the lifestyles of others. This is a case in which conservatives are interfering in the lives of liberals, not the other way around. The truly conservative thing to do would be to charge each Hoosier the true cost of his license plates, and let him put whatever he wants on it. Stealing cash from unsuspecting folks to fund special interest plates should be totally contrary to true conservative values. But I guess this just shows that conservatives are the new "tax and spend" group, and liberals are the ones trying to prune the tendrils of overreaching government these days. "Please get a life and let us conservatives live ours."

That's just the point. Hoosiers who don't necessarily subscribe to that statement are paying for the lifestyles of others. This is a case in which conservatives are interfering in the lives of liberals, not the other way around.

The truly conservative thing to do would be to charge each Hoosier the true cost of his license plates, and let him put whatever he wants on it. Stealing cash from unsuspecting folks to fund special interest plates should be totally contrary to true conservative values.

But I guess this just shows that conservatives are the new "tax and spend" group, and liberals are the ones trying to prune the tendrils of overreaching government these days.

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